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okay here's our interview with sarah

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wynn i want to just kind of start with

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uh you know a brief primer

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on soviet union and poison who

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did did lenin's the stalin started did

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lenin started uh was it did the where

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the tsar is using poison does this have

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a long history in russia soviet union in

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a strange twist of fate both linen and

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stalin were poisoned themselves despite

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starting what's called laboratory one in

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around 1921

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uh it was a divide it was a lab uh

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specializing in literary killing of

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individuals they had a group called

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special tasks that would either kill

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people within russia that were

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inconvenient for stalin or uh you know

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white russian immigrants who had left

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and refused to return so it was often

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done secretly and they would celebrate

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actually if they would test people they

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call them rabbits and there was a prison

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an adjoining prison called the libyanca

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and they would bring people and even

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interviewed poisoners from auschwitz

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nazi poisoners and they would learn try

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to find ways to poison people where it

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would look like a natural death so if

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you for instance suffered from a heart

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condition they would give you potassium

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they said oh well he died of a heart

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condition or uh we believe for instance

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anna pavlova was killed with anthrax

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anthrax would mimic uh pulmonary

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diseases

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and so they send these test rabbits off

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for autopsy and if the doctors doing

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autopsy said what looks like they died

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of natural causes then they would

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rejoice

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and we say test wrap literally rabbits

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they actually started off with animals

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and learned that animals didn't give

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them the results that they wanted so

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they actually called um their test

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rabbits birdies and they were humans

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humans they would pull from the lubianca

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wow it's really

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what's what's the bianca

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that was the the prison i was just

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mentioning that it was a

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back in stalin times the lubianca and

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lab one were connected underground via

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tunnels wow and but you're saying it

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actually started under lenin

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we think probably around 1921 22

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uh it started

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and then stalin stalin was the main face

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of it however and

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give us a ballpark number of how many

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people you think stalin poisoned

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you know

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that's a really good guess when i

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started researching this i thought

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hitler was the worst

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killer that had ever lived and stalin

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killed tens of millions of people

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i don't think we can even accurately

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know the number

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give us a little quick summary of

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stalin's reign and and so on because his

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name is coming back up today john

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mentioned that uh his

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his his photo um or depiction is on

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buses now in moscow you've got

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putin supposedly um kind of uh

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uh resurrecting stalin to some extent so

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what what are the key things people need

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to know about stalin

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interestingly he didn't start off as a

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villain he um was born in

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1878 i believe

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and uh

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was actually went to parochial school he

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was his mother

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was named kiki he loved her dearly she

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was deeply religious but his father was

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very abusive he was a alcoholic and

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would often beat them and he would um

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when he would lose his job he'd leave

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for years at a time and uh but with help

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his mother got him into parochial

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schools and actually he went to seminary

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i believe it or not but within four

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years he discovered marxism as his

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religion uh he was kicked out of the

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seminary uh he even

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an interesting story on his mother's

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deathbed uh he he told her mom had

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become the czar and she said it would

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have been much better for you if you'd

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become the priest a priest

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so unfortunately he didn't follow in her

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footsteps

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so is he instrumental in the revolution

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along with lenin

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i think so he he actually um

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his his successes began when he became

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lenin's assistant and um sverdlov was uh

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lenin's chief of staff at the time and

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he did not like stalin interestingly

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stalin

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well spurglov died of lung poisoning

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shortly thereafter that was one of

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stalin's first attempts to rise he saw

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that the accretion of power

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that uh parmus stalin had

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was not a good thing but stalin learned

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of it and killed him and then uh stalin

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became linen's secretary and rose up the

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ranks from there

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and walk us through stalin's greatest

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atrocities

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oh man

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that's a that's a hard question i think

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it would be his establishment of

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laboratory one and then also a group

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called the yasha gang that ran out of

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paris

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um they were notorious killers that

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would kill secretly in these literary

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killings um we allege in the book uh i

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believe for the first time that anna

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pavlova was killed by stalin

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there are over 40 biographies of anna

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pavlova

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and we couldn't find anyone else

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attributing her death to stalin despite

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her saying i've been poisoned by the

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food i ate in paris

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and and before we get into her poisoning

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and some of the others

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the the tens of millions that you say

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stalin killed

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tell us about

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that well there are many examples he he

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followed a doctrine called cultural

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hegemony and so he he realized to

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control he believed to control man he

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needed to also con to control the arts

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and theater in the minds of man and so

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he would um

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kill artists

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that didn't agree with his philosophy uh

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pavlova was one she loved the imperial

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ballet and imperial russia before the

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bolshevik revolution so she was an

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example of someone who had to be killed

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another thing

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he destroyed the great cathedral of

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christ the savior was another symbol of

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old russia imperial russia

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interestingly it was rebuilt exactly the

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same between 2000 and 2005. but um those

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are examples of he wanted to kill people

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another famous example under his

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cultural hegemony policy was his killing

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of the cobsars

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these were roaming musicians that played

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on this on the ukrainian steps for um

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years hundreds of years and uh he

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summoned them uh all together 300 of

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them uh pretending to create

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a union to help them and he shot them

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all and killed them and buried them in a

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grave uh so lost was their wonderful

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music you know on the steps but how do

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we get to tens of millions is that

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through the famine or what was the

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problem he also initiated famine in the

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ukraine he uh seized the grain stocks

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and yes so famine in ukraine was a huge

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a huge way that he did that right right

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so um okay tell us about anna pablova

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um and and how she rose to a position

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where stalin would want to kill her

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she was declared an enemy of the state

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and you think why would a beautiful

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ballerina be declared an enemy of the

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state and why would stalin care but she

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represented this old russia that he

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couldn't stand uh he wanted the new

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marxist russia and the imperial russia

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of the romanovs to be gone

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she

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not the traditional ballerina

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and rose up through the imperial ballet

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with marcus patipa her mentor

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she then danced with the um uh ballet

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rousseau with uh sturdy diagolov who we

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also allege was killed by stalin

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and then when diagolov began

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diverting from the traditional ballet

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she left and started her own ballet

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she traveled 400 000 miles before air

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travel which is pretty remarkable she

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she said her prayer was her dance and

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she wanted to see the world with ballet

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so she was she was just an image of um

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old russia that stalin couldn't tolerate

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so when was she born

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she was born in

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let me see

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she was born

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i need to go back and look within three

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years of stalin's birth

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i believe i'll have to go okay we have

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all of this and

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she was already even before the

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revolution she was known

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yeah well she actually made a name for

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herself she was a student with patipa in

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uh the imperial ballet and then in the

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great ball of 1903 the winter ball which

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was a famous ball that the romanovs put

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on every year to celebrate the new year

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and also their reign

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it was

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consisted of many days of parties the

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masquerade ball being the largest but

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she actually opened the uh winter ball

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uh dancing swan lake under patipa's

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instruction she graduated there from

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student to famous ballerina her career

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took off from there and that was really

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the beginning of the end of the imperial

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reign of the romanovs

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would she was she so big that she would

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have been known even in the united

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states oh definitely she traveled here

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actually and danced with the houston

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valley i'm from houston

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so she has she visited 44 countries

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okay so she she would be like

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burishnikov is who i think of today is

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our russian dancer that became world war

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ii actually she had many friends in

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hollywood and uh she starred um

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she started one one film the dumb girl

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of porcini but but a film after her

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death a year later was called grand

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hotel it won the academy award in 1932

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uh for best picture and it was modeled

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after a russian ballerina

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many think pavlova okay so she was a

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major celebrity in russia than obviously

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she was russia and the rest of the world

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she escaped um

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she wasn't in russia during the

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revolution at that time she had a home

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in london called the ivy house where she

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she really was a wonderful person inside

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and out she developed an orphanage

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a school for orphans she she tutored for

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very little money rising ballerinas

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she had a foundation um that was later

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um taken from by stalin and proceeds

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given to the red army but she was a

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wonderful person and stood for

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everything stalin couldn't tolerate

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yeah i mean i wasn't familiar with her

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until i

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got

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noticed your guys book so um

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[Music]

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the fact that so many biographies have

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been written about her

279
00:10:43,350 --> 00:10:40,880
tell us a little bit about what makes

280
00:10:44,870 --> 00:10:43,360
her so special besides just being a

281
00:10:47,269 --> 00:10:44,880
famous ballerina

282
00:10:49,110 --> 00:10:47,279
well she inter like i was saying she was

283
00:10:50,790 --> 00:10:49,120
so tiny she's not who you would look at

284
00:10:52,389 --> 00:10:50,800
initially and think my goodness that's

285
00:10:55,269 --> 00:10:52,399
the most wonderful ballerina i've ever

286
00:10:57,110 --> 00:10:55,279
seen but patipa taught her that her

287
00:10:59,750 --> 00:10:57,120
weaknesses were actually her strength so

288
00:11:01,990 --> 00:10:59,760
her frailty and her tenderness and she

289
00:11:04,310 --> 00:11:02,000
had a way of possessing really

290
00:11:07,350 --> 00:11:04,320
spirituality through her dance not just

291
00:11:08,870 --> 00:11:07,360
her face but her body and she became

292
00:11:10,550 --> 00:11:08,880
world famous for it no one has ever

293
00:11:13,350 --> 00:11:10,560
really been able to touch it what's

294
00:11:15,350 --> 00:11:13,360
really neat also is uh she danced this

295
00:11:18,870 --> 00:11:15,360
dance called the dying swan that she

296
00:11:19,829 --> 00:11:18,880
danced over 4 000 times and um

297
00:11:22,790 --> 00:11:19,839
although

298
00:11:24,230 --> 00:11:22,800
pavlova has been dead for 90 years uh

299
00:11:25,590 --> 00:11:24,240
when we were preparing we have a book

300
00:11:27,910 --> 00:11:25,600
launch coming up and we're preparing a

301
00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:27,920
powerpoint presentation we actually end

302
00:11:33,269 --> 00:11:30,880
it with i believe it's 34 ballerinas

303
00:11:35,030 --> 00:11:33,279
from around the world dancing the dying

304
00:11:35,910 --> 00:11:35,040
swan for covid relief

305
00:11:37,750 --> 00:11:35,920
so

306
00:11:39,829 --> 00:11:37,760
it's it's like a tree that burns down

307
00:11:42,870 --> 00:11:39,839
but plants seeds or the butterfly effect

308
00:11:45,110 --> 00:11:42,880
the flapping of wings so she's gone but

309
00:11:47,269 --> 00:11:45,120
she lives on in the minds of many people

310
00:11:48,150 --> 00:11:47,279
who love her and admire her

311
00:11:49,590 --> 00:11:48,160
so

312
00:11:51,590 --> 00:11:49,600
what i fail to do that i should have is

313
00:11:52,710 --> 00:11:51,600
just i usually like read the wikipedia

314
00:11:54,230 --> 00:11:52,720
on somebody so i should have read the

315
00:11:57,030 --> 00:11:54,240
wikipedia on because i'm really not that

316
00:12:00,310 --> 00:11:57,040
knowledgeable about her but her world

317
00:12:02,470 --> 00:12:00,320
acclaim was primarily just as

318
00:12:05,269 --> 00:12:02,480
essentially the most famous

319
00:12:07,590 --> 00:12:05,279
ballet dancer ever essentially

320
00:12:10,069 --> 00:12:07,600
arguably i think many would say that she

321
00:12:12,470 --> 00:12:10,079
also took ballet she viewed it as her

322
00:12:14,870 --> 00:12:12,480
mission to bring ballet around the world

323
00:12:16,710 --> 00:12:14,880
and um one of her most famous maybe

324
00:12:18,710 --> 00:12:16,720
objectively her best dance of the four

325
00:12:22,389 --> 00:12:18,720
thousand times she danced the swan was

326
00:12:24,470 --> 00:12:22,399
in mexico in 1919 uh

327
00:12:27,269 --> 00:12:24,480
the um

328
00:12:29,350 --> 00:12:27,279
mexican revolution was going on uh

329
00:12:31,670 --> 00:12:29,360
carranza had taken control the

330
00:12:33,990 --> 00:12:31,680
revolutionary zapata had just been

331
00:12:36,230 --> 00:12:34,000
killed the american council said we

332
00:12:38,069 --> 00:12:36,240
advise you heavily do not go to mexico

333
00:12:40,550 --> 00:12:38,079
this is not safe for you and she

334
00:12:42,150 --> 00:12:40,560
traveled anyway with 200 armed guards on

335
00:12:44,310 --> 00:12:42,160
top of her train

336
00:12:46,790 --> 00:12:44,320
and she danced the venue they chose for

337
00:12:48,550 --> 00:12:46,800
her was the famous bull ring

338
00:12:50,829 --> 00:12:48,560
to bring classical ballet for the first

339
00:12:54,310 --> 00:12:50,839
time to mexico as she did it by

340
00:12:56,710 --> 00:12:54,320
torchlight and um surprising her as she

341
00:12:59,030 --> 00:12:56,720
started to dance pablo casal which was

342
00:13:02,069 --> 00:12:59,040
at the time the most famous cellist rose

343
00:13:04,310 --> 00:13:02,079
from the crowd and played for her uh and

344
00:13:07,030 --> 00:13:04,320
so it was really a spectacular

345
00:13:09,829 --> 00:13:07,040
presentation her company at the end had

346
00:13:11,829 --> 00:13:09,839
choreographed a dance in pointe shoes to

347
00:13:13,829 --> 00:13:11,839
the mexican hat dance which

348
00:13:15,990 --> 00:13:13,839
traditionally had been shunned by the

349
00:13:17,670 --> 00:13:16,000
upper classes but they loved it and it

350
00:13:19,030 --> 00:13:17,680
became the national dance of mexico

351
00:13:20,790 --> 00:13:19,040
after that

352
00:13:23,190 --> 00:13:20,800
she went to australia and strawberries

353
00:13:26,310 --> 00:13:23,200
pavlova was named for her she danced

354
00:13:28,310 --> 00:13:26,320
with elephants in germany she posed in

355
00:13:29,670 --> 00:13:28,320
front of the great sphinx

356
00:13:31,829 --> 00:13:29,680
she traveled

357
00:13:33,269 --> 00:13:31,839
everywhere and was loved by everyone she

358
00:13:35,190 --> 00:13:33,279
met

359
00:13:36,150 --> 00:13:35,200
has there been a film made about her or

360
00:13:37,750 --> 00:13:36,160
uh

361
00:13:40,150 --> 00:13:37,760
you know

362
00:13:43,590 --> 00:13:40,160
not a feature film not that i'm aware of

363
00:13:46,389 --> 00:13:43,600
no documentaries correct right and was

364
00:13:48,870 --> 00:13:46,399
she political in any way

365
00:13:51,430 --> 00:13:48,880
she initially said uh pardon me during

366
00:13:55,590 --> 00:13:51,440
the revolution she initially sympathized

367
00:13:57,829 --> 00:13:55,600
uh with the revolutionaries uh but then

368
00:13:59,829 --> 00:13:57,839
left russia and and understand that

369
00:14:00,949 --> 00:13:59,839
understood the danger and and stayed out

370
00:14:03,590 --> 00:14:00,959
of russia

371
00:14:06,389 --> 00:14:03,600
and so why did she become a target of

372
00:14:08,389 --> 00:14:06,399
stalin in your guy's view

373
00:14:10,870 --> 00:14:08,399
well because she represented everything

374
00:14:13,590 --> 00:14:10,880
he couldn't stand he wanted to he when

375
00:14:15,110 --> 00:14:13,600
he destroyed the uh the church of the

376
00:14:16,790 --> 00:14:15,120
cathedral the great cathedral i was

377
00:14:18,389 --> 00:14:16,800
telling you about with the golden dome

378
00:14:19,350 --> 00:14:18,399
he also destroyed at the same time

379
00:14:21,430 --> 00:14:19,360
something called the gate of

380
00:14:23,829 --> 00:14:21,440
resurrection and

381
00:14:26,389 --> 00:14:23,839
people had prayed there for 400 years

382
00:14:27,829 --> 00:14:26,399
entering red square uh at the time

383
00:14:30,310 --> 00:14:27,839
stalin said we don't need a gator

384
00:14:33,110 --> 00:14:30,320
resurrect a gate of resurrection because

385
00:14:36,550 --> 00:14:33,120
by 1937 the word god itself will be

386
00:14:39,430 --> 00:14:36,560
removed from this the russian vocabulary

387
00:14:41,590 --> 00:14:39,440
and she represented uh religion and

388
00:14:43,030 --> 00:14:41,600
freedom and um

389
00:14:45,910 --> 00:14:43,040
everything that that he wanted to

390
00:14:48,150 --> 00:14:45,920
suppress and and stalin was no fan of

391
00:14:50,790 --> 00:14:48,160
the arts is that what you're saying no

392
00:14:52,790 --> 00:14:50,800
he he was a fan he was actually a singer

393
00:14:54,389 --> 00:14:52,800
and somewhat of a poet himself that he

394
00:14:55,910 --> 00:14:54,399
was a fan of the arts as long as it

395
00:14:58,150 --> 00:14:55,920
could be used as an instrument of the

396
00:15:00,550 --> 00:14:58,160
state art for art's sake beauty for

397
00:15:03,430 --> 00:15:00,560
beauty steak he he couldn't tolerate

398
00:15:06,310 --> 00:15:03,440
that and so he actually sent a woman

399
00:15:07,590 --> 00:15:06,320
named um alexandra colontai

400
00:15:09,829 --> 00:15:07,600
she was the

401
00:15:12,870 --> 00:15:09,839
ambassador to norway he sent her to

402
00:15:14,790 --> 00:15:12,880
norway to try her try to stop her 1931

403
00:15:16,629 --> 00:15:14,800
tour that they laughed at her and said

404
00:15:18,230 --> 00:15:16,639
no we're not going to do that she was an

405
00:15:20,710 --> 00:15:18,240
awful character she believed children

406
00:15:23,829 --> 00:15:20,720
belong to the state et cetera but by

407
00:15:26,550 --> 00:15:23,839
sending colleen ty to stop pavlova that

408
00:15:28,949 --> 00:15:26,560
clearly came from the top ranks and

409
00:15:29,990 --> 00:15:28,959
he saw her as an enemy that he had to

410
00:15:33,590 --> 00:15:30,000
get rid of

411
00:15:35,269 --> 00:15:33,600
so she was not uh supporting the

412
00:15:37,670 --> 00:15:35,279
revolution in the new communist

413
00:15:39,829 --> 00:15:37,680
government but she wasn't it sounds like

414
00:15:41,910 --> 00:15:39,839
she wasn't necessarily

415
00:15:43,590 --> 00:15:41,920
speaking out against it

416
00:15:46,629 --> 00:15:43,600
well she was in the sense that she was

417
00:15:48,870 --> 00:15:46,639
defying stalin she wasn't returning when

418
00:15:51,829 --> 00:15:48,880
asked to return um

419
00:15:53,670 --> 00:15:51,839
she was and actually in 1925

420
00:15:56,069 --> 00:15:53,680
stalin sent her mother who had been

421
00:15:58,870 --> 00:15:56,079
missing for seven years sent her to

422
00:16:01,110 --> 00:15:58,880
london to try to recruit pavlova back it

423
00:16:02,790 --> 00:16:01,120
was it was an operation called operation

424
00:16:05,670 --> 00:16:02,800
trust where they were trying to recruit

425
00:16:07,110 --> 00:16:05,680
white russian immigrants back to russia

426
00:16:08,470 --> 00:16:07,120
and there they would either be exploited

427
00:16:10,629 --> 00:16:08,480
or killed

428
00:16:13,189 --> 00:16:10,639
she said i'm not going back her mother

429
00:16:15,670 --> 00:16:13,199
against pavlova's wishes did go back and

430
00:16:16,550 --> 00:16:15,680
was never heard from again

431
00:16:18,790 --> 00:16:16,560
so

432
00:16:20,069 --> 00:16:18,800
where was she when she died and what

433
00:16:24,069 --> 00:16:20,079
year was it

434
00:16:26,949 --> 00:16:24,079
so that was in 1931 she was in

435
00:16:29,430 --> 00:16:26,959
she was in paris preparing for her 1931

436
00:16:30,710 --> 00:16:29,440
tour she was despite being five feet

437
00:16:34,069 --> 00:16:30,720
tall she was very brave she was

438
00:16:35,110 --> 00:16:34,079
preparing to go uh on to dance in poland

439
00:16:37,509 --> 00:16:35,120
right on

440
00:16:39,749 --> 00:16:37,519
the border so she wasn't afraid but she

441
00:16:41,590 --> 00:16:39,759
had lunch in her hotel room in paris and

442
00:16:43,910 --> 00:16:41,600
then boarded a train for the netherlands

443
00:16:47,030 --> 00:16:43,920
she was to dance at the hague and she

444
00:16:48,629 --> 00:16:47,040
became ill on the train and uh she even

445
00:16:50,790 --> 00:16:48,639
said i've been poisoned by the food i

446
00:16:52,949 --> 00:16:50,800
ate in paris and no one took her

447
00:16:55,749 --> 00:16:52,959
seriously they treated her for pleurisy

448
00:16:56,790 --> 00:16:55,759
they drained her lungs um they did other

449
00:16:57,509 --> 00:16:56,800
things that

450
00:16:59,749 --> 00:16:57,519
just

451
00:17:00,470 --> 00:16:59,759
didn't work and at the time though you

452
00:17:02,069 --> 00:17:00,480
know

453
00:17:03,590 --> 00:17:02,079
josh's gang the group i was telling you

454
00:17:04,789 --> 00:17:03,600
about that operated out of paris

455
00:17:07,110 --> 00:17:04,799
secretly

456
00:17:09,510 --> 00:17:07,120
their antics awful antics wouldn't be

457
00:17:11,110 --> 00:17:09,520
known for 60 plus years so in their

458
00:17:12,710 --> 00:17:11,120
defense when she said i've been poisoned

459
00:17:14,549 --> 00:17:12,720
in paris

460
00:17:15,909 --> 00:17:14,559
that wasn't a likely thing that the

461
00:17:17,590 --> 00:17:15,919
doctors would have suspected had

462
00:17:19,909 --> 00:17:17,600
happened

463
00:17:23,829 --> 00:17:19,919
and how old was she at that time

464
00:17:25,829 --> 00:17:23,839
she was uh let me see 49 years old

465
00:17:28,950 --> 00:17:25,839
wow so she was dancing at a

466
00:17:31,029 --> 00:17:28,960
pretty advanced age yeah i know it she

467
00:17:32,470 --> 00:17:31,039
at the time of her death she

468
00:17:34,230 --> 00:17:32,480
they were supposed to dance the next

469
00:17:36,390 --> 00:17:34,240
night in the hague and she called her

470
00:17:38,230 --> 00:17:36,400
company together and swore that they

471
00:17:40,549 --> 00:17:38,240
would continue to dance despite her

472
00:17:42,230 --> 00:17:40,559
dying she asked for her swan costume

473
00:17:44,390 --> 00:17:42,240
made the cross sign of the cross and

474
00:17:46,950 --> 00:17:44,400
died and then true to form true to their

475
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:46,960
promise the next night they did perform

476
00:17:51,590 --> 00:17:48,880
and when the dying swan was played a

477
00:17:52,870 --> 00:17:51,600
spotlight shown on on the stage where

478
00:17:53,750 --> 00:17:52,880
she would have been

479
00:17:55,750 --> 00:17:53,760
um

480
00:17:57,270 --> 00:17:55,760
the crowd was in tears the

481
00:17:58,630 --> 00:17:57,280
queen king and queen of belgium were

482
00:18:00,390 --> 00:17:58,640
there in tears

483
00:18:02,070 --> 00:18:00,400
so so i guess what you're saying is

484
00:18:03,990 --> 00:18:02,080
poisonings weren't necessarily well

485
00:18:06,070 --> 00:18:04,000
known at that time so it wouldn't have

486
00:18:08,549 --> 00:18:06,080
been highly suspected they weren't known

487
00:18:11,110 --> 00:18:08,559
at the time no it was more a tool of

488
00:18:12,310 --> 00:18:11,120
stalin to get rid of inconvenient people

489
00:18:15,590 --> 00:18:12,320
and actually

490
00:18:17,430 --> 00:18:15,600
pavlova's death uh was

491
00:18:19,909 --> 00:18:17,440
if you want to say executed perfectly

492
00:18:21,830 --> 00:18:19,919
because having been poisoned in paris

493
00:18:23,510 --> 00:18:21,840
and then boarded the train all of the

494
00:18:25,830 --> 00:18:23,520
evidence you know that they would have

495
00:18:28,470 --> 00:18:25,840
needed was in another city at the time

496
00:18:30,789 --> 00:18:28,480
and um it was it really was kind of the

497
00:18:32,630 --> 00:18:30,799
perfect crime well and is it also fair

498
00:18:35,190 --> 00:18:32,640
to say that people would naturally think

499
00:18:36,870 --> 00:18:35,200
of her as someone who would be targeted

500
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:36,880
for poisoning

501
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:38,880
the only reason it was possible is she

502
00:18:43,270 --> 00:18:40,960
had been declared an enemy of the state

503
00:18:45,510 --> 00:18:43,280
which was not popular at the time and

504
00:18:46,630 --> 00:18:45,520
after colin thai was sent to talk to her

505
00:18:47,870 --> 00:18:46,640
um

506
00:18:51,110 --> 00:18:47,880
she in

507
00:18:54,630 --> 00:18:51,120
1925 i believe or no probably 1930 to

508
00:18:57,510 --> 00:18:54,640
stop her tour um in pola in norway

509
00:18:59,350 --> 00:18:57,520
pardon me uh she spoke with a friend and

510
00:19:01,110 --> 00:18:59,360
said please go to a russian orthodox

511
00:19:02,870 --> 00:19:01,120
church and pla and pray for me i feel a

512
00:19:04,870 --> 00:19:02,880
dark heavy cloud like a sword of

513
00:19:06,549 --> 00:19:04,880
damocles over my head

514
00:19:08,070 --> 00:19:06,559
so i think

515
00:19:10,470 --> 00:19:08,080
she knew she was in trouble at that

516
00:19:11,909 --> 00:19:10,480
point and friends of hers had died as

517
00:19:14,470 --> 00:19:11,919
well and

518
00:19:15,909 --> 00:19:14,480
so i i think that was another reason

519
00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:15,919
when she said i've been poisoned by the

520
00:19:19,430 --> 00:19:18,000
food in paris she's she saw it coming

521
00:19:21,430 --> 00:19:19,440
somewhat

522
00:19:24,070 --> 00:19:21,440
and i'm sorry did you say that your book

523
00:19:26,070 --> 00:19:24,080
is the first to allege that her death

524
00:19:27,590 --> 00:19:26,080
was as a result of a poisoning that's my

525
00:19:30,150 --> 00:19:27,600
understanding we read several

526
00:19:32,070 --> 00:19:30,160
biographies we rely heavily on three but

527
00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:32,080
i believe there are over 40 biographies

528
00:19:36,710 --> 00:19:34,080
written we have

529
00:19:39,029 --> 00:19:36,720
approximately 650 endnotes in this book

530
00:19:41,270 --> 00:19:39,039
it has been researched so heavily and no

531
00:19:43,430 --> 00:19:41,280
no one else blames there are a couple

532
00:19:45,510 --> 00:19:43,440
that mentioned she was poisoned she said

533
00:19:46,470 --> 00:19:45,520
i was poisoned by the food in paris but

534
00:19:48,950 --> 00:19:46,480
no one

535
00:19:50,870 --> 00:19:48,960
tracks it back to stalin

536
00:19:53,190 --> 00:19:50,880
so what did you guys

537
00:19:56,390 --> 00:19:53,200
discover that

538
00:19:57,990 --> 00:19:56,400
allows you to make that assertion

539
00:19:59,669 --> 00:19:58,000
looking at the yasha gang and other

540
00:20:01,990 --> 00:19:59,679
people that he was killing at the same

541
00:20:03,590 --> 00:20:02,000
time in much the same way

542
00:20:05,430 --> 00:20:03,600
one of such people was a man named

543
00:20:09,830 --> 00:20:05,440
diagola

544
00:20:12,310 --> 00:20:09,840
diagolov who was neither a producer uh

545
00:20:15,029 --> 00:20:12,320
dancer or choreographer a party dancer

546
00:20:16,390 --> 00:20:15,039
or choreographer he was a producer uh of

547
00:20:17,669 --> 00:20:16,400
the ballet rousseau i don't know if

548
00:20:20,070 --> 00:20:17,679
you've heard of the valley rousseau

549
00:20:22,230 --> 00:20:20,080
before but it was began in about 1909

550
00:20:24,230 --> 00:20:22,240
1910 he became

551
00:20:26,310 --> 00:20:24,240
probably the most famous ballet producer

552
00:20:29,029 --> 00:20:26,320
in the world at the time they were very

553
00:20:30,870 --> 00:20:29,039
different in personality and temperament

554
00:20:34,070 --> 00:20:30,880
um although they both

555
00:20:35,990 --> 00:20:34,080
both grew up in the imperial ballet um

556
00:20:38,870 --> 00:20:36,000
diagolov became famous for his

557
00:20:41,110 --> 00:20:38,880
outrageous uh performances he was much

558
00:20:42,870 --> 00:20:41,120
like the cirque du soleil of today he

559
00:20:46,310 --> 00:20:42,880
deviated from classical ballet that

560
00:20:48,070 --> 00:20:46,320
pavlova loved so much um but he also was

561
00:20:49,510 --> 00:20:48,080
a genius at pulling together really

562
00:20:51,990 --> 00:20:49,520
discovering and pulling together

563
00:20:56,070 --> 00:20:52,000
remarkable talent so um george

564
00:20:58,470 --> 00:20:56,080
balanchine and lafaar and naginski and

565
00:21:01,270 --> 00:20:58,480
coco chanel designed the costumes pablo

566
00:21:02,710 --> 00:21:01,280
picasso matisse designed the sets it was

567
00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:02,720
a spectacular

568
00:21:07,110 --> 00:21:05,360
um event uh that

569
00:21:09,190 --> 00:21:07,120
this whole experience as we would say

570
00:21:10,549 --> 00:21:09,200
today that he created

571
00:21:13,430 --> 00:21:10,559
and sorry you're saying he was also

572
00:21:14,870 --> 00:21:13,440
poisoned yes he was poisoned in venice

573
00:21:17,190 --> 00:21:14,880
uh but again it was

574
00:21:19,990 --> 00:21:17,200
it was intended to look like a natural

575
00:21:22,870 --> 00:21:20,000
death he died of boils on his stomach

576
00:21:25,270 --> 00:21:22,880
that wouldn't heal he was diabetic um

577
00:21:27,190 --> 00:21:25,280
but we think he was he was fed melitosis

578
00:21:29,830 --> 00:21:27,200
at the time which was a

579
00:21:32,390 --> 00:21:29,840
disease that would mimic that

580
00:21:34,310 --> 00:21:32,400
and we think that because melatosis was

581
00:21:36,789 --> 00:21:34,320
being weaponized at the time at the

582
00:21:39,110 --> 00:21:36,799
camps where his brothers and nephews

583
00:21:41,750 --> 00:21:39,120
were arrested and taken he also was

584
00:21:44,870 --> 00:21:41,760
declared an enemy of the state after

585
00:21:48,310 --> 00:21:44,880
lunacharsky one of stalin's top aides

586
00:21:51,830 --> 00:21:48,320
approached him in 1925 and invited him

587
00:21:53,270 --> 00:21:51,840
to return back to russia an invitation

588
00:21:56,149 --> 00:21:53,280
he couldn't refuse

589
00:21:57,909 --> 00:21:56,159
he said no i luna charsky came back and

590
00:22:00,390 --> 00:21:57,919
declared him an enemy enemy of this

591
00:22:02,870 --> 00:22:00,400
state in an elitist

592
00:22:05,270 --> 00:22:02,880
so it's much the same similar situation

593
00:22:07,909 --> 00:22:05,280
as we're seeing with pavlova right and

594
00:22:09,430 --> 00:22:07,919
pavlova was otherwise in obviously in

595
00:22:11,590 --> 00:22:09,440
pretty good health at the time she was

596
00:22:12,549 --> 00:22:11,600
about to go dance yes and they they

597
00:22:14,230 --> 00:22:12,559
proposed

598
00:22:15,830 --> 00:22:14,240
you know

599
00:22:17,270 --> 00:22:15,840
crazy preposterous things about what

600
00:22:19,350 --> 00:22:17,280
could have led to her death some people

601
00:22:22,230 --> 00:22:19,360
said she had stood in the rain a couple

602
00:22:24,230 --> 00:22:22,240
days earlier and that led to it some

603
00:22:27,350 --> 00:22:24,240
people even said she had exercised in

604
00:22:29,110 --> 00:22:27,360
too cold of a room but just one person

605
00:22:30,630 --> 00:22:29,120
said it was from surgical instruments

606
00:22:32,390 --> 00:22:30,640
she got blood poisoning when they were

607
00:22:34,789 --> 00:22:32,400
draining her lungs

608
00:22:36,149 --> 00:22:34,799
but i think pavlova knew at the time and

609
00:22:39,190 --> 00:22:36,159
announced

610
00:22:41,190 --> 00:22:39,200
how she'd been killed and i don't

611
00:22:42,070 --> 00:22:41,200
we're pretty certain that that happened

612
00:22:43,909 --> 00:22:42,080
yeah

613
00:22:45,029 --> 00:22:43,919
so um

614
00:22:47,190 --> 00:22:45,039
so

615
00:22:48,950 --> 00:22:47,200
stalin was prolific in these type of

616
00:22:50,549 --> 00:22:48,960
poisonings you guys assert

617
00:22:52,310 --> 00:22:50,559
in the book i'm curious because i want

618
00:22:57,029 --> 00:22:52,320
to bring it up to to what putin's been

619
00:22:59,110 --> 00:22:57,039
up to so between stalin and putin

620
00:23:01,590 --> 00:22:59,120
were there other leaders that were also

621
00:23:03,590 --> 00:23:01,600
engaging in in this kind of stuff

622
00:23:07,350 --> 00:23:03,600
really under gorbachev the poison lab

623
00:23:08,549 --> 00:23:07,360
was shut down um and then putin started

624
00:23:11,510 --> 00:23:08,559
it up again

625
00:23:13,190 --> 00:23:11,520
in large force so our book is

626
00:23:15,029 --> 00:23:13,200
interesting if you read the back jacket

627
00:23:18,549 --> 00:23:15,039
you think how does ana pavlova lead to

628
00:23:21,110 --> 00:23:18,559
covet 19 it's quite a ra a range but it

629
00:23:24,470 --> 00:23:21,120
makes sense if you think about these

630
00:23:26,630 --> 00:23:24,480
literary killings that began in 1921 uh

631
00:23:29,510 --> 00:23:26,640
stalin was able to to get around the

632
00:23:31,270 --> 00:23:29,520
nuclear stalemate by

633
00:23:33,750 --> 00:23:31,280
really

634
00:23:35,669 --> 00:23:33,760
developing these bio weapons that are

635
00:23:39,029 --> 00:23:35,679
can be just as dangerous as a nuclear

636
00:23:41,110 --> 00:23:39,039
weapon and they with putin uh stalin and

637
00:23:43,350 --> 00:23:41,120
then especially putin they grew

638
00:23:45,909 --> 00:23:43,360
large-scale so this same marxist

639
00:23:48,789 --> 00:23:45,919
stalinist ideology these labs spread to

640
00:23:52,070 --> 00:23:48,799
north korea and to china um we know

641
00:23:53,350 --> 00:23:52,080
they're 14 bio labs in china right now

642
00:23:55,909 --> 00:23:53,360
um

643
00:23:57,350 --> 00:23:55,919
you hear often about the wuhan lab but

644
00:23:59,350 --> 00:23:57,360
we believe that

645
00:24:01,909 --> 00:23:59,360
the leak of kova 19 actually happened

646
00:24:04,230 --> 00:24:01,919
from an adjacent military lab

647
00:24:07,029 --> 00:24:04,240
with top clearance that the who never

648
00:24:09,190 --> 00:24:07,039
got to inspect and you really never know

649
00:24:11,190 --> 00:24:09,200
anything about it it's a it's

650
00:24:13,110 --> 00:24:11,200
very top secret we know from defectors

651
00:24:15,590 --> 00:24:13,120
that people um

652
00:24:18,390 --> 00:24:15,600
have are working in those labs

653
00:24:20,549 --> 00:24:18,400
with the woohon lab and

654
00:24:23,029 --> 00:24:20,559
we think largely that covet 19 was

655
00:24:25,029 --> 00:24:23,039
hushed so much the release of it because

656
00:24:26,789 --> 00:24:25,039
they're working on much worse things

657
00:24:27,830 --> 00:24:26,799
than that and they didn't want the

658
00:24:30,710 --> 00:24:27,840
origin

659
00:24:32,230 --> 00:24:30,720
to be traced back to wuhan yeah

660
00:24:34,390 --> 00:24:32,240
yeah and

661
00:24:36,470 --> 00:24:34,400
john walked us through some of that um

662
00:24:38,390 --> 00:24:36,480
in the interview yesterday which was

663
00:24:39,669 --> 00:24:38,400
great um and

664
00:24:41,909 --> 00:24:39,679
the fact that

665
00:24:43,190 --> 00:24:41,919
the u.s assisted in

666
00:24:45,909 --> 00:24:43,200
dismantling

667
00:24:48,710 --> 00:24:45,919
bioweapons labs uh and then putin

668
00:24:50,950 --> 00:24:48,720
started bringing him back but but but

669
00:24:53,510 --> 00:24:50,960
how do you connect poisoning with with

670
00:24:55,590 --> 00:24:53,520
with bio labs is it all kind of the same

671
00:24:58,310 --> 00:24:55,600
do they concoct their poisons in the in

672
00:25:00,390 --> 00:24:58,320
the bio weapons labs or is it

673
00:25:03,269 --> 00:25:00,400
it is they're related so they're doing

674
00:25:05,269 --> 00:25:03,279
um now doing gain of function testing

675
00:25:06,149 --> 00:25:05,279
and weaponizing

676
00:25:08,310 --> 00:25:06,159
um

677
00:25:09,990 --> 00:25:08,320
these viruses you know i think there's

678
00:25:12,070 --> 00:25:10,000
confusion sometimes today because you

679
00:25:14,470 --> 00:25:12,080
hear bio lab and you think oh that's

680
00:25:16,549 --> 00:25:14,480
that's a horrible terrible thing but i

681
00:25:19,269 --> 00:25:16,559
believe there are 40 000 bio labs in the

682
00:25:22,149 --> 00:25:19,279
u.s so anytime we get our blood drawn or

683
00:25:24,630 --> 00:25:22,159
taken you know biolabs in themselves

684
00:25:26,470 --> 00:25:24,640
is a benefit of science and helps us but

685
00:25:27,990 --> 00:25:26,480
the biowarfare labs we're calling them

686
00:25:30,070 --> 00:25:28,000
are the ones where they're doing the

687
00:25:31,990 --> 00:25:30,080
gain of function research to make

688
00:25:36,950 --> 00:25:32,000
marburg or

689
00:25:39,269 --> 00:25:36,960
something like that um that's what we're

690
00:25:40,710 --> 00:25:39,279
calling bio-war labs and that's what

691
00:25:42,870 --> 00:25:40,720
began under

692
00:25:45,029 --> 00:25:42,880
putin apartment under stalin and is now

693
00:25:46,470 --> 00:25:45,039
raging under putin

694
00:25:48,630 --> 00:25:46,480
so um

695
00:25:50,630 --> 00:25:48,640
how about between stalin and putin were

696
00:25:53,669 --> 00:25:50,640
any of the other leaders khrushchev etc

697
00:25:55,430 --> 00:25:53,679
were any of them known for poisonings

698
00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:55,440
they definitely knew what was happening

699
00:25:59,029 --> 00:25:57,440
yes khrushchev and molotov were called

700
00:26:01,029 --> 00:25:59,039
to um

701
00:26:03,669 --> 00:26:01,039
stalin's dasha the night he died

702
00:26:06,310 --> 00:26:03,679
actually uh and stalin was famous for

703
00:26:08,470 --> 00:26:06,320
reading his top management i think

704
00:26:12,310 --> 00:26:08,480
everyone dealt with stalin very

705
00:26:15,990 --> 00:26:12,320
carefully he uh and he did it to

706
00:26:19,430 --> 00:26:16,000
continue the deniability of his actions

707
00:26:20,950 --> 00:26:19,440
it happened first in 1938 uh and it's a

708
00:26:22,950 --> 00:26:20,960
great called the great purge where he

709
00:26:25,269 --> 00:26:22,960
just got rid of his top management and

710
00:26:27,830 --> 00:26:25,279
again in 19 in the 1950s in what's

711
00:26:30,390 --> 00:26:27,840
called the doctor's plot where his top

712
00:26:31,990 --> 00:26:30,400
management was accused of poisonings and

713
00:26:33,990 --> 00:26:32,000
um they

714
00:26:36,470 --> 00:26:34,000
had to testify to it but weren't able to

715
00:26:38,549 --> 00:26:36,480
to say that it was at stalin's um

716
00:26:40,470 --> 00:26:38,559
direction but yes khrushchev and molotov

717
00:26:42,390 --> 00:26:40,480
were there the night before he died uh

718
00:26:43,909 --> 00:26:42,400
the story is that what we learned is

719
00:26:46,310 --> 00:26:43,919
they had dinner together they allegedly

720
00:26:47,669 --> 00:26:46,320
watched a movie together they uh stayed

721
00:26:50,390 --> 00:26:47,679
up drinking until four or five in the

722
00:26:52,789 --> 00:26:50,400
morning and then the following day on

723
00:26:55,510 --> 00:26:52,799
march the first uh around one in the

724
00:26:58,230 --> 00:26:55,520
afternoon a maid and a guard went into

725
00:27:00,310 --> 00:26:58,240
stalin's room and found him on the floor

726
00:27:02,870 --> 00:27:00,320
unconscious soaked in urine they

727
00:27:04,789 --> 00:27:02,880
notified beria at the time he was stalin

728
00:27:06,950 --> 00:27:04,799
second in command

729
00:27:08,870 --> 00:27:06,960
and he said he's fine he's recovering

730
00:27:10,710 --> 00:27:08,880
from a night of hard drinking they

731
00:27:12,870 --> 00:27:10,720
changed him put him in his bed didn't

732
00:27:15,029 --> 00:27:12,880
call doctors or anything um the

733
00:27:18,149 --> 00:27:15,039
following morning at 7 00 a.m baria

734
00:27:20,070 --> 00:27:18,159
finally sent doctors in to care for him

735
00:27:21,350 --> 00:27:20,080
it was too late he died on the fifth on

736
00:27:23,590 --> 00:27:21,360
march 5th

737
00:27:26,149 --> 00:27:23,600
but um but yes all of they were all

738
00:27:28,149 --> 00:27:26,159
aware of of the poisoning happening and

739
00:27:31,029 --> 00:27:28,159
and and there's some controversy about

740
00:27:32,230 --> 00:27:31,039
stalin's death right it's only of

741
00:27:33,830 --> 00:27:32,240
late that

742
00:27:35,909 --> 00:27:33,840
people now believe that he was poisoned

743
00:27:37,750 --> 00:27:35,919
or walk us through that

744
00:27:41,190 --> 00:27:37,760
well yes we do believe he was poisoned

745
00:27:43,269 --> 00:27:41,200
by barrio uh two reasons both uh he

746
00:27:45,750 --> 00:27:43,279
according to molotov and khrushchev

747
00:27:49,110 --> 00:27:45,760
beria himself said i've poisoned him and

748
00:27:51,909 --> 00:27:49,120
then in barry's trial he's he said you

749
00:27:54,230 --> 00:27:51,919
should thank me i avoided a nuclear war

750
00:27:56,549 --> 00:27:54,240
so um

751
00:27:58,389 --> 00:27:56,559
berries says that he learned of stalin

752
00:28:00,870 --> 00:27:58,399
wanting to create world war iii with

753
00:28:02,789 --> 00:28:00,880
nuclear weapons and that he saved the

754
00:28:04,389 --> 00:28:02,799
world by poisoning

755
00:28:06,789 --> 00:28:04,399
stalin we believe he did it with

756
00:28:09,190 --> 00:28:06,799
warfarin which is now a rat poison

757
00:28:10,870 --> 00:28:09,200
ironically um

758
00:28:13,510 --> 00:28:10,880
inappropriately

759
00:28:17,029 --> 00:28:13,520
um but it would cause internal bleeding

760
00:28:18,310 --> 00:28:17,039
which would mimic his symptoms and they

761
00:28:21,590 --> 00:28:18,320
treated it with leeches which was

762
00:28:23,110 --> 00:28:21,600
exactly the opposite thing to do um

763
00:28:25,990 --> 00:28:23,120
but yes we believe he was killed with

764
00:28:27,909 --> 00:28:26,000
warfarin on bury his own words

765
00:28:29,669 --> 00:28:27,919
and then what about khrushchev during

766
00:28:32,149 --> 00:28:29,679
his reign

767
00:28:34,230 --> 00:28:32,159
is it believed that khrushchev poisoned

768
00:28:36,710 --> 00:28:34,240
anyone while he was leading the soviet

769
00:28:38,950 --> 00:28:36,720
union we don't have much evidence of

770
00:28:40,470 --> 00:28:38,960
that uh gorbachev and khrushchev no i

771
00:28:42,149 --> 00:28:40,480
think uh

772
00:28:44,870 --> 00:28:42,159
john may be able to tell you differently

773
00:28:47,110 --> 00:28:44,880
but i i believe it was stalin and then

774
00:28:48,789 --> 00:28:47,120
picked up again with lenin i know shut

775
00:28:51,590 --> 00:28:48,799
down with gorbachev but actually in the

776
00:28:52,610 --> 00:28:51,600
same location in laboratory one

777
00:28:54,149 --> 00:28:52,620
and um

778
00:28:55,830 --> 00:28:54,159
[Music]

779
00:28:59,350 --> 00:28:55,840
do you subscribe to the belief that that

780
00:29:02,070 --> 00:28:59,360
putin kind of idolizes stalin oh i think

781
00:29:04,389 --> 00:29:02,080
there's no doubt in fact um stalin's

782
00:29:08,070 --> 00:29:04,399
mentor when he became prime minister

783
00:29:09,909 --> 00:29:08,080
night in 2019 was asked i'll probably um

784
00:29:12,710 --> 00:29:09,919
1999

785
00:29:14,230 --> 00:29:12,720
and anatoly sobchak his mentor

786
00:29:16,230 --> 00:29:14,240
at was asked

787
00:29:18,870 --> 00:29:16,240
tell us about uh putin what's your

788
00:29:20,710 --> 00:29:18,880
impression and his quote was putin is

789
00:29:23,430 --> 00:29:20,720
the new stalin

790
00:29:25,909 --> 00:29:23,440
so i think yes that was

791
00:29:27,669 --> 00:29:25,919
widely recognized and i don't know if

792
00:29:30,389 --> 00:29:27,679
how much you go into this in the book

793
00:29:32,549 --> 00:29:30,399
but where do we stand on the body count

794
00:29:34,549 --> 00:29:32,559
now with putin how many

795
00:29:36,630 --> 00:29:34,559
people has he poisoned

796
00:29:38,470 --> 00:29:36,640
much much like

797
00:29:40,950 --> 00:29:38,480
stalin i don't know that we'll ever know

798
00:29:42,310 --> 00:29:40,960
those numbers um

799
00:29:43,990 --> 00:29:42,320
you know

800
00:29:45,669 --> 00:29:44,000
many many thousands

801
00:29:47,750 --> 00:29:45,679
what how many would you say at this

802
00:29:49,510 --> 00:29:47,760
point are we reported you know it just

803
00:29:51,029 --> 00:29:49,520
seems like every about six months or so

804
00:29:53,750 --> 00:29:51,039
you hear about someone who was poisoned

805
00:29:55,190 --> 00:29:53,760
somewhere and it's believed to have been

806
00:29:56,950 --> 00:29:55,200
russia that did it

807
00:29:59,590 --> 00:29:56,960
well the other thing we're reading about

808
00:30:01,909 --> 00:29:59,600
often right now um i believe there have

809
00:30:03,669 --> 00:30:01,919
been seven oligarchs

810
00:30:06,789 --> 00:30:03,679
who committed suicide

811
00:30:10,149 --> 00:30:06,799
uh in in recent days one the most recent

812
00:30:12,630 --> 00:30:10,159
is just terrific um a man in his villa

813
00:30:15,110 --> 00:30:12,640
in spain was found hung

814
00:30:16,870 --> 00:30:15,120
and his wife and child were killed with

815
00:30:17,990 --> 00:30:16,880
an axe and a knife that had been wiped

816
00:30:20,070 --> 00:30:18,000
clean

817
00:30:22,389 --> 00:30:20,080
so i mean you just you're hearing things

818
00:30:24,149 --> 00:30:22,399
all the time it may not be poison in

819
00:30:27,110 --> 00:30:24,159
itself but there there are also these

820
00:30:28,870 --> 00:30:27,120
literally killings

821
00:30:31,590 --> 00:30:28,880
and uh what about uh what can you tell

822
00:30:33,350 --> 00:30:31,600
us about the navalny poisoning because

823
00:30:34,630 --> 00:30:33,360
that's the one that seems to be getting

824
00:30:38,070 --> 00:30:34,640
the most attention right now he's

825
00:30:39,430 --> 00:30:38,080
sitting in prison um in russia somewhere

826
00:30:41,750 --> 00:30:39,440
and

827
00:30:44,070 --> 00:30:41,760
perhaps laying in wait in hopes that one

828
00:30:45,029 --> 00:30:44,080
day that people are able to oust putin

829
00:30:47,590 --> 00:30:45,039
and

830
00:30:49,430 --> 00:30:47,600
maybe navalny will take over

831
00:30:51,990 --> 00:30:49,440
well that would be

832
00:30:53,909 --> 00:30:52,000
if history repeats itself like

833
00:30:55,190 --> 00:30:53,919
lenin was poisoned and stalin was

834
00:30:56,870 --> 00:30:55,200
poisoned

835
00:30:59,350 --> 00:30:56,880
that would be the hope right that

836
00:31:01,909 --> 00:30:59,360
someone from the inside would do it um

837
00:31:03,909 --> 00:31:01,919
navalny sure is a brave man

838
00:31:07,590 --> 00:31:03,919
and to be poisoned with novichok and to

839
00:31:12,310 --> 00:31:07,600
come back and now be imprisoned and um

840
00:31:15,110 --> 00:31:13,029
what

841
00:31:17,350 --> 00:31:15,120
i doubt he will be i don't think he'll

842
00:31:19,509 --> 00:31:17,360
see the light of day much like the uh

843
00:31:21,430 --> 00:31:19,519
people in cheese china now that just

844
00:31:23,029 --> 00:31:21,440
disappear you know

845
00:31:25,830 --> 00:31:23,039
never to be seen up again there are many

846
00:31:27,669 --> 00:31:25,840
surrounding the uh coveted 19 release dr

847
00:31:29,269 --> 00:31:27,679
lee who was the whistleblower that

848
00:31:32,789 --> 00:31:29,279
announced the leak

849
00:31:34,230 --> 00:31:32,799
died quickly um you know

850
00:31:36,470 --> 00:31:34,240
in addition to all the records being

851
00:31:38,389 --> 00:31:36,480
demolished and uh people have a way of

852
00:31:41,029 --> 00:31:38,399
conveniently disappearing both in russia

853
00:31:43,350 --> 00:31:41,039
and china yeah yeah china's been pretty

854
00:31:44,789 --> 00:31:43,360
prolific and doing the same thing uh

855
00:31:46,230 --> 00:31:44,799
what is

856
00:31:47,909 --> 00:31:46,240
the connection between the two i mean

857
00:31:51,190 --> 00:31:47,919
obviously both

858
00:31:52,630 --> 00:31:51,200
former communist countries china

859
00:31:55,350 --> 00:31:52,640
still communists

860
00:31:57,830 --> 00:31:55,360
um and in both using these

861
00:32:00,549 --> 00:31:57,840
same type of uh poisons to

862
00:32:02,070 --> 00:32:00,559
kill people they both called each other

863
00:32:05,269 --> 00:32:02,080
friends i think that they are they're

864
00:32:06,870 --> 00:32:05,279
both in violation of the 1972 bioweapons

865
00:32:08,470 --> 00:32:06,880
uh convention

866
00:32:10,470 --> 00:32:08,480
that out ruled

867
00:32:13,350 --> 00:32:10,480
the use of bioweapons

868
00:32:15,750 --> 00:32:13,360
we stopped at the time

869
00:32:17,110 --> 00:32:15,760
allegedly kept working on our defense of

870
00:32:18,070 --> 00:32:17,120
bioweapons

871
00:32:20,149 --> 00:32:18,080
but

872
00:32:22,470 --> 00:32:20,159
they saw that as a green light to go

873
00:32:24,310 --> 00:32:22,480
forward and like i say now it's well

874
00:32:25,509 --> 00:32:24,320
advanced we even learned that the

875
00:32:28,630 --> 00:32:25,519
russian

876
00:32:30,710 --> 00:32:28,640
uh military spends one of five days

877
00:32:32,149 --> 00:32:30,720
training in hazmat suits

878
00:32:33,669 --> 00:32:32,159
uh and the only reason that they would

879
00:32:35,350 --> 00:32:33,679
do that would be so that they would be

880
00:32:36,149 --> 00:32:35,360
prepared in the event

881
00:32:37,990 --> 00:32:36,159
they

882
00:32:40,230 --> 00:32:38,000
used chemical weapons and their

883
00:32:42,789 --> 00:32:40,240
opponents would not which is a very

884
00:32:46,230 --> 00:32:42,799
frightening thing especially seeing how

885
00:32:47,830 --> 00:32:46,240
the u.s handled the release of covet 19

886
00:32:49,669 --> 00:32:47,840
i don't think anyone would say we were

887
00:32:50,470 --> 00:32:49,679
prepared for that

888
00:32:52,149 --> 00:32:50,480
it does

889
00:32:55,350 --> 00:32:52,159
has the u.s

890
00:32:57,909 --> 00:32:55,360
sanctioned china in any way for these

891
00:33:00,389 --> 00:32:57,919
bio weapons labs that our intelligence

892
00:33:03,269 --> 00:33:00,399
says that they have

893
00:33:05,669 --> 00:33:03,279
that's a good question uh in 2015 we

894
00:33:06,950 --> 00:33:05,679
stopped providing funding for them

895
00:33:08,230 --> 00:33:06,960
um

896
00:33:10,789 --> 00:33:08,240
we learned

897
00:33:11,909 --> 00:33:10,799
through their of their gain of function

898
00:33:13,990 --> 00:33:11,919
um

899
00:33:16,630 --> 00:33:14,000
performing on gain a function test on

900
00:33:19,830 --> 00:33:16,640
these labs and increasing the virulence

901
00:33:20,789 --> 00:33:19,840
and deadliness of viruses so 2015 we

902
00:33:22,149 --> 00:33:20,799
stopped

903
00:33:23,750 --> 00:33:22,159
giving the money

904
00:33:26,149 --> 00:33:23,760
but i think more needs to be done i

905
00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:26,159
think a large reason we wrote this book

906
00:33:30,230 --> 00:33:27,760
was to raise awareness of what's

907
00:33:31,830 --> 00:33:30,240
actually happening uh i think a lot of

908
00:33:33,590 --> 00:33:31,840
people

909
00:33:35,269 --> 00:33:33,600
i think if the monkeys hear no evil see

910
00:33:37,509 --> 00:33:35,279
no evil it's easier to be ignorant and

911
00:33:40,310 --> 00:33:37,519
not know what's happening but

912
00:33:42,789 --> 00:33:40,320
man if covid19 is any gauge we need to

913
00:33:45,029 --> 00:33:42,799
be prepared for what is as dangerous as

914
00:33:47,830 --> 00:33:45,039
a nuclear attack yeah

915
00:33:49,909 --> 00:33:47,840
water etc

916
00:33:52,149 --> 00:33:49,919
i don't know how expert you are on this

917
00:33:54,230 --> 00:33:52,159
gain of function

918
00:33:55,029 --> 00:33:54,240
issue but it sounds like you're saying

919
00:33:57,190 --> 00:33:55,039
that

920
00:33:59,509 --> 00:33:57,200
gain of function research would only be

921
00:34:02,310 --> 00:33:59,519
used to create a bio weapon i i thought

922
00:34:03,830 --> 00:34:02,320
that there was some innocuous potential

923
00:34:05,750 --> 00:34:03,840
reason

924
00:34:07,669 --> 00:34:05,760
well with crispr tools and things like

925
00:34:09,829 --> 00:34:07,679
that then i'll begin by saying no i'm

926
00:34:12,710 --> 00:34:09,839
not an expert on it but with crispr

927
00:34:15,349 --> 00:34:12,720
tools and things like that they can

928
00:34:17,030 --> 00:34:15,359
make terrible terrible diseases for for

929
00:34:19,909 --> 00:34:17,040
instance the hunter project i don't know

930
00:34:22,389 --> 00:34:19,919
if you're familiar with that but um that

931
00:34:26,069 --> 00:34:22,399
would be um you you take certain

932
00:34:28,149 --> 00:34:26,079
ethnicities and um

933
00:34:30,310 --> 00:34:28,159
use the for instance jewish people if

934
00:34:32,149 --> 00:34:30,320
their dna

935
00:34:34,550 --> 00:34:32,159
shows signs

936
00:34:36,710 --> 00:34:34,560
individual signs that are distinct from

937
00:34:39,589 --> 00:34:36,720
other people that they would develop

938
00:34:42,230 --> 00:34:39,599
diseases to only target them so bni it

939
00:34:43,669 --> 00:34:42,240
would be a way to wipe out certain races

940
00:34:45,349 --> 00:34:43,679
or ethnicities

941
00:34:47,430 --> 00:34:45,359
that would be an example of a nefarious

942
00:34:49,589 --> 00:34:47,440
project

943
00:34:51,909 --> 00:34:49,599
is there a benevolent

944
00:34:53,430 --> 00:34:51,919
reason to do gain a function i i thought

945
00:34:55,589 --> 00:34:53,440
that you know one of these says oh we're

946
00:34:58,230 --> 00:34:55,599
going to create potential viruses so we

947
00:35:00,470 --> 00:34:58,240
know how to address them blah blah blah

948
00:35:02,550 --> 00:35:00,480
oh sure that's that was the

949
00:35:04,950 --> 00:35:02,560
initial plan is to

950
00:35:07,589 --> 00:35:04,960
test viruses and so that

951
00:35:10,390 --> 00:35:07,599
we have vaccines we have you know ways

952
00:35:13,349 --> 00:35:10,400
to fight it if it's released the problem

953
00:35:15,670 --> 00:35:13,359
falls in when you have these bio labs

954
00:35:17,270 --> 00:35:15,680
testing small pox and other things like

955
00:35:19,349 --> 00:35:17,280
that and they're leaks

956
00:35:21,270 --> 00:35:19,359
uh and that's why in 2015 it was shut

957
00:35:23,030 --> 00:35:21,280
down because we realized it was too

958
00:35:24,710 --> 00:35:23,040
dangerous the technology to do it

959
00:35:26,870 --> 00:35:24,720
actually came out of the university of

960
00:35:30,310 --> 00:35:26,880
north carolina i believe that we shared

961
00:35:32,710 --> 00:35:30,320
with the wuhan lab um

962
00:35:33,829 --> 00:35:32,720
but then when we realized the nefarious

963
00:35:35,589 --> 00:35:33,839
uses

964
00:35:39,270 --> 00:35:35,599
then then money

965
00:35:42,470 --> 00:35:39,280
was cut off in 2015.

966
00:35:44,710 --> 00:35:42,480
uh do you have any gauge on um

967
00:35:46,870 --> 00:35:44,720
the ability of

968
00:35:49,190 --> 00:35:46,880
people around putin to take him out the

969
00:35:50,550 --> 00:35:49,200
way you believe stalin was taken out you

970
00:35:52,230 --> 00:35:50,560
know it's interesting if you'll see

971
00:35:53,990 --> 00:35:52,240
pictures of him he's at the end of a

972
00:35:56,069 --> 00:35:54,000
very long table

973
00:35:58,310 --> 00:35:56,079
he doesn't let people get close to him

974
00:35:59,990 --> 00:35:58,320
and um kind of an interesting story

975
00:36:02,630 --> 00:36:00,000
about stalin remember me telling you the

976
00:36:04,790 --> 00:36:02,640
night that he was killed and he had uh

977
00:36:07,270 --> 00:36:04,800
molotov and khrushchev there he was at

978
00:36:08,950 --> 00:36:07,280
his favorite dasha that really became in

979
00:36:10,950 --> 00:36:08,960
his later age his

980
00:36:13,270 --> 00:36:10,960
permanent residence it had a moat

981
00:36:15,910 --> 00:36:13,280
surrounding it it had two fences with

982
00:36:18,150 --> 00:36:15,920
anti-aircraft weapons and 300 guards on

983
00:36:19,670 --> 00:36:18,160
top of it and what fell them

984
00:36:23,270 --> 00:36:19,680
was a tiny

985
00:36:27,310 --> 00:36:26,150
i i think it would be fitting and ironic

986
00:36:30,150 --> 00:36:27,320
and entirely

987
00:36:32,069 --> 00:36:30,160
possible plausible for stalin to be

988
00:36:33,430 --> 00:36:32,079
taken out with poison as well

989
00:36:36,230 --> 00:36:33,440
there have to be and i think that's one

990
00:36:39,430 --> 00:36:36,240
reason these oligarchs are dying um

991
00:36:41,270 --> 00:36:39,440
pollen uh putin has to be facing

992
00:36:43,109 --> 00:36:41,280
people who disagree with his policies

993
00:36:44,150 --> 00:36:43,119
and as he learns about them he takes

994
00:36:46,710 --> 00:36:44,160
them out

995
00:36:49,589 --> 00:36:46,720
yeah and i mean it's not clear to me who

996
00:36:51,589 --> 00:36:49,599
is even allowed to be around him right i

997
00:36:53,750 --> 00:36:51,599
don't know if these oligarchs are around

998
00:36:55,510 --> 00:36:53,760
him um

999
00:36:58,390 --> 00:36:55,520
it seems like some of these high-level

1000
00:37:00,310 --> 00:36:58,400
military leaders are probably around him

1001
00:37:02,550 --> 00:37:00,320
occasionally and i know that there's

1002
00:37:04,230 --> 00:37:02,560
some former military leader that's

1003
00:37:07,270 --> 00:37:04,240
already spoken out significantly i

1004
00:37:09,270 --> 00:37:07,280
forget his name uh regarding putin so

1005
00:37:11,190 --> 00:37:09,280
in stalin's later days he was a very

1006
00:37:11,990 --> 00:37:11,200
lonely man he wouldn't let anyone around

1007
00:37:14,630 --> 00:37:12,000
him

1008
00:37:16,150 --> 00:37:14,640
uh for i think for fear of being killed

1009
00:37:18,950 --> 00:37:16,160
by his friends

1010
00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:18,960
right right um yeah i mean

1011
00:37:23,750 --> 00:37:21,040
other than that i don't see he seems to

1012
00:37:24,870 --> 00:37:23,760
be pretty secure putin does in his

1013
00:37:25,829 --> 00:37:24,880
position

1014
00:37:27,670 --> 00:37:25,839
right now

1015
00:37:28,870 --> 00:37:27,680
obviously very hard to oppose him you go

1016
00:37:31,430 --> 00:37:28,880
out into the street you're going to wind

1017
00:37:33,349 --> 00:37:31,440
up in in jail his you know

1018
00:37:35,670 --> 00:37:33,359
security forces around him are very

1019
00:37:36,710 --> 00:37:35,680
strong but yet his popularity seems to

1020
00:37:40,710 --> 00:37:36,720
still be

1021
00:37:46,870 --> 00:37:43,510
i i can't imagine it would stay that way

1022
00:37:48,790 --> 00:37:46,880
long i or i hope not at any rate

1023
00:37:51,670 --> 00:37:48,800
i hope that one of his friends

1024
00:37:54,150 --> 00:37:51,680
wises up and and stops his atrocities

1025
00:37:56,470 --> 00:37:54,160
yeah uh and what what do you know about

1026
00:37:58,950 --> 00:37:56,480
the poisoning of navalny as far as uh

1027
00:38:00,230 --> 00:37:58,960
what poison was used and

1028
00:38:02,470 --> 00:38:00,240
why

1029
00:38:04,710 --> 00:38:02,480
and how he was able to survive it

1030
00:38:07,030 --> 00:38:04,720
uh you know i i think it was novichok

1031
00:38:10,790 --> 00:38:07,040
that he was poisoned with and i think

1032
00:38:13,349 --> 00:38:10,800
got hospital attention quickly enough to

1033
00:38:14,950 --> 00:38:13,359
to have care but uh i think what do you

1034
00:38:15,829 --> 00:38:14,960
know about nova chalk i'm not familiar

1035
00:38:17,910 --> 00:38:15,839
with it

1036
00:38:20,470 --> 00:38:17,920
it's a poison

1037
00:38:22,390 --> 00:38:20,480
it is i can't speak to navalny's

1038
00:38:25,510 --> 00:38:22,400
poisoning uh

1039
00:38:27,910 --> 00:38:25,520
as much um

1040
00:38:29,270 --> 00:38:27,920
the book focuses primarily on poisonings

1041
00:38:31,109 --> 00:38:29,280
of stalin

1042
00:38:34,550 --> 00:38:31,119
but i do know that that is what he was

1043
00:38:36,950 --> 00:38:34,560
poisoned with and received attention

1044
00:38:39,349 --> 00:38:36,960
is that a is that a new form of poison

1045
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:39,359
that wasn't around in stalin's

1046
00:38:42,710 --> 00:38:40,400
europe

1047
00:38:45,270 --> 00:38:42,720
i don't remember studying

1048
00:38:47,190 --> 00:38:45,280
that poison in stallman's days

1049
00:38:48,470 --> 00:38:47,200
what what was stalin

1050
00:38:51,670 --> 00:38:48,480
using primarily

1051
00:38:54,470 --> 00:38:51,680
he used potassium and uh curate for

1052
00:38:55,910 --> 00:38:54,480
heart attacks he used anthrax he used

1053
00:38:58,630 --> 00:38:55,920
melatosis

1054
00:39:02,069 --> 00:38:58,640
um so he had a quite an arsenal

1055
00:39:04,390 --> 00:39:02,079
of his own uh-huh and as you said all of

1056
00:39:06,230 --> 00:39:04,400
them designed to make it look like the

1057
00:39:08,230 --> 00:39:06,240
person died of natural

1058
00:39:09,589 --> 00:39:08,240
all designed to make natural causes

1059
00:39:12,630 --> 00:39:09,599
that's right

1060
00:39:13,670 --> 00:39:12,640
to be able to to keep denying his

1061
00:39:14,390 --> 00:39:13,680
involvement

1062
00:39:15,829 --> 00:39:14,400
yeah

1063
00:39:17,190 --> 00:39:15,839
this novichok

1064
00:39:19,270 --> 00:39:17,200
poisoning that you're referring to

1065
00:39:21,829 --> 00:39:19,280
doesn't seem to be one where you care

1066
00:39:23,750 --> 00:39:21,839
about making it look natural considering

1067
00:39:25,270 --> 00:39:23,760
you know sometimes sometimes he didn't

1068
00:39:29,430 --> 00:39:25,280
that was interesting i mean these

1069
00:39:31,030 --> 00:39:29,440
literally murders um that marinovsky and

1070
00:39:32,630 --> 00:39:31,040
sergey spiegelglass and all of these

1071
00:39:35,510 --> 00:39:32,640
assassins that he employed in the yasha

1072
00:39:38,550 --> 00:39:35,520
group were so adept at doing sometimes

1073
00:39:40,950 --> 00:39:38,560
uh stalin and i think also putin

1074
00:39:42,390 --> 00:39:40,960
wants to make a statement

1075
00:39:44,470 --> 00:39:42,400
with the killing i mean

1076
00:39:47,190 --> 00:39:44,480
we in the book talk about people being

1077
00:39:49,589 --> 00:39:47,200
gunned down in the street um

1078
00:39:51,030 --> 00:39:49,599
professor tikken and um

1079
00:39:53,270 --> 00:39:51,040
other people being gunned down in the

1080
00:39:55,270 --> 00:39:53,280
street so oftentimes it was done

1081
00:39:58,630 --> 00:39:55,280
secretly but if he wanted to make a

1082
00:40:00,790 --> 00:39:58,640
point then they did that as well

1083
00:40:01,829 --> 00:40:00,800
yeah obviously putin always denies it

1084
00:40:04,390 --> 00:40:01,839
but

1085
00:40:06,390 --> 00:40:04,400
you kind of get the sense that he knows

1086
00:40:07,910 --> 00:40:06,400
we know and he doesn't care that's

1087
00:40:10,950 --> 00:40:07,920
that's happened for a long time you'll

1088
00:40:11,750 --> 00:40:10,960
remember raul wallenberg the ambassador

1089
00:40:19,270 --> 00:40:11,760
and

1090
00:40:22,870 --> 00:40:19,280
treated as a birdie in laboratory one

1091
00:40:26,710 --> 00:40:22,880
and uh during this stalin era and

1092
00:40:28,230 --> 00:40:26,720
vanished uh the russians denied

1093
00:40:29,349 --> 00:40:28,240
first denied having them then said

1094
00:40:31,510 --> 00:40:29,359
having in them but that he would be

1095
00:40:33,829 --> 00:40:31,520
released soon then went back and said we

1096
00:40:36,950 --> 00:40:33,839
don't have any trace of him uh he did

1097
00:40:38,950 --> 00:40:36,960
die in the in the lab one uh and they

1098
00:40:41,589 --> 00:40:38,960
gave him i'm forgetting the name of the

1099
00:40:43,750 --> 00:40:41,599
poison but it made his organs shrink

1100
00:40:46,150 --> 00:40:43,760
um which and it was an excruciating

1101
00:40:49,270 --> 00:40:46,160
death they're they're famous for perform

1102
00:40:50,870 --> 00:40:49,280
performing autopsies immediately to get

1103
00:40:52,950 --> 00:40:50,880
rid of any

1104
00:40:54,710 --> 00:40:52,960
way of acknowledging that these people

1105
00:40:58,550 --> 00:40:54,720
have been poisoned

1106
00:41:01,030 --> 00:40:58,560
so um the us is adhering to the 1972

1107
00:41:02,790 --> 00:41:01,040
treaty on bioweapons and um you know we

1108
00:41:04,790 --> 00:41:02,800
have we have nukes but we don't have bio

1109
00:41:06,710 --> 00:41:04,800
weapons so

1110
00:41:09,109 --> 00:41:06,720
what what

1111
00:41:12,069 --> 00:41:09,119
what should the u.s be doing

1112
00:41:16,309 --> 00:41:12,079
about china's and russia's

1113
00:41:18,550 --> 00:41:16,319
violence that's a good question i saw um

1114
00:41:20,630 --> 00:41:18,560
last week six or seven congressmen

1115
00:41:25,829 --> 00:41:20,640
demanding more answers as to the

1116
00:41:28,870 --> 00:41:25,839
cover-up of the covet-19 virus

1117
00:41:30,790 --> 00:41:28,880
i think it starts with information

1118
00:41:33,270 --> 00:41:30,800
learning making the world aware of

1119
00:41:33,940 --> 00:41:33,280
what's happening and then

1120
00:41:35,270 --> 00:41:33,950
imposing

1121
00:41:37,270 --> 00:41:35,280
[Music]

1122
00:41:39,270 --> 00:41:37,280
incredible sanctions to make it stop

1123
00:41:43,270 --> 00:41:39,280
it's it's a very frightening problem i

1124
00:41:44,950 --> 00:41:43,280
think it's as frightening as nuclear war

1125
00:41:47,829 --> 00:41:44,960
well and we need

1126
00:41:49,510 --> 00:41:47,839
people like elon musk apparently to buy

1127
00:41:51,670 --> 00:41:49,520
the social media company so the word can

1128
00:41:55,670 --> 00:41:51,680
get out because um

1129
00:41:57,109 --> 00:41:55,680
that that word was not allowed to be out

1130
00:41:59,510 --> 00:41:57,119
on youtube

1131
00:42:01,349 --> 00:41:59,520
on twitter on facebook you weren't

1132
00:42:04,069 --> 00:42:01,359
allowed to say that this

1133
00:42:05,910 --> 00:42:04,079
came from a lab let alone is a bio

1134
00:42:07,670 --> 00:42:05,920
weapon i don't know

1135
00:42:09,510 --> 00:42:07,680
in fact we'll all have

1136
00:42:12,230 --> 00:42:09,520
fun with this because we put these up on

1137
00:42:15,109 --> 00:42:12,240
youtube and let's see what youtube does

1138
00:42:16,470 --> 00:42:15,119
when we say that kovid uh was likely a

1139
00:42:18,230 --> 00:42:16,480
bio weapon

1140
00:42:20,069 --> 00:42:18,240
i encourage people to read the book john

1141
00:42:22,150 --> 00:42:20,079
and i are both lawyers and i think

1142
00:42:25,190 --> 00:42:22,160
present a pretty clear case if we were

1143
00:42:27,430 --> 00:42:25,200
trying this case in court that kovid 19

1144
00:42:29,670 --> 00:42:27,440
was formed in a lab we know that they

1145
00:42:32,630 --> 00:42:29,680
had brought bats from

1146
00:42:35,109 --> 00:42:32,640
the himalayas called horseshoe bats who

1147
00:42:38,230 --> 00:42:35,119
carry a virus that's 96.2

1148
00:42:40,950 --> 00:42:38,240
similar to covet 19. there's a 3.8

1149
00:42:44,150 --> 00:42:40,960
percent difference um we've read that

1150
00:42:46,390 --> 00:42:44,160
that includes a furion cleavage site uh

1151
00:42:48,790 --> 00:42:46,400
where this spiked protein is held that

1152
00:42:52,470 --> 00:42:48,800
doesn't exist in any other virus within

1153
00:42:56,230 --> 00:42:52,480
this family we've also learned that it's

1154
00:42:57,750 --> 00:42:56,240
i believe uh 12 bars of rna long exactly

1155
00:42:59,670 --> 00:42:57,760
that kind of precision just doesn't

1156
00:43:02,309 --> 00:42:59,680
happen in the lab you look at other

1157
00:43:04,069 --> 00:43:02,319
circumstantial evidence um

1158
00:43:06,230 --> 00:43:04,079
i think of recipes a liquid or the thing

1159
00:43:09,030 --> 00:43:06,240
speaks for itself i mean it was

1160
00:43:11,030 --> 00:43:09,040
disclosed on the doorstep of the wuhan

1161
00:43:12,950 --> 00:43:11,040
virology lab and i don't know did you

1162
00:43:15,270 --> 00:43:12,960
see the clip with jon stewart when he

1163
00:43:17,510 --> 00:43:15,280
was asked uh the comedian jon stewart

1164
00:43:19,589 --> 00:43:17,520
yeah he was on late night television and

1165
00:43:21,270 --> 00:43:19,599
saying isn't it seem pretty obvious that

1166
00:43:23,349 --> 00:43:21,280
it it does

1167
00:43:25,670 --> 00:43:23,359
and and made the joke that if there was

1168
00:43:27,270 --> 00:43:25,680
a leak in hershey pennsylvania we

1169
00:43:29,270 --> 00:43:27,280
wouldn't say that a hershey being mated

1170
00:43:31,589 --> 00:43:29,280
with a snow plow we would look at the

1171
00:43:33,510 --> 00:43:31,599
facts in front of us see that the the

1172
00:43:36,470 --> 00:43:33,520
first patient came from there they

1173
00:43:37,910 --> 00:43:36,480
immediately deleted all evidence that

1174
00:43:39,589 --> 00:43:37,920
that would have been able to research it

1175
00:43:44,470 --> 00:43:39,599
the who came a year

1176
00:43:47,190 --> 00:43:44,480
hw came w who came a year later uh

1177
00:43:49,750 --> 00:43:47,200
all of the inspectors were appointed by

1178
00:43:51,910 --> 00:43:49,760
uh chi they weren't allowed to visit the

1179
00:43:54,150 --> 00:43:51,920
top secret level four military lab where

1180
00:43:56,710 --> 00:43:54,160
we believe they were doing this um

1181
00:43:58,710 --> 00:43:56,720
testing i mean there's so many things

1182
00:44:01,990 --> 00:43:58,720
that point to

1183
00:44:05,030 --> 00:44:02,000
covet 19 coming from the lab yeah

1184
00:44:06,309 --> 00:44:05,040
who else who's the most prominent person

1185
00:44:11,829 --> 00:44:06,319
or

1186
00:44:13,589 --> 00:44:11,839
you say is agreeing with your guys

1187
00:44:16,470 --> 00:44:13,599
theory

1188
00:44:18,710 --> 00:44:16,480
i think many are agreeing now initially

1189
00:44:19,910 --> 00:44:18,720
they weren't but we but specifically

1190
00:44:22,390 --> 00:44:19,920
craigman from wrong you guys are

1191
00:44:24,390 --> 00:44:22,400
alleging that it was a bio weapon i hear

1192
00:44:26,390 --> 00:44:24,400
a lot of people saying it came from a

1193
00:44:28,790 --> 00:44:26,400
lab but i think you guys are saying that

1194
00:44:30,710 --> 00:44:28,800
it came from the military lab and it was

1195
00:44:33,430 --> 00:44:30,720
being developed as a bio weapon

1196
00:44:35,430 --> 00:44:33,440
that's what we believe right so that i

1197
00:44:37,670 --> 00:44:35,440
don't not hearing many people say i'm

1198
00:44:39,750 --> 00:44:37,680
hearing a lot of saying it came from the

1199
00:44:41,990 --> 00:44:39,760
wuhan lab of virology

1200
00:44:42,950 --> 00:44:42,000
uh that it would accidentally escape

1201
00:44:45,190 --> 00:44:42,960
perhaps

1202
00:44:48,390 --> 00:44:45,200
there's a lot of connection between the

1203
00:44:50,309 --> 00:44:48,400
two and we've we've learned from

1204
00:44:54,069 --> 00:44:50,319
people who have since left ken alabeck

1205
00:44:55,910 --> 00:44:54,079
who wrote a book called biohazards um

1206
00:44:58,230 --> 00:44:55,920
some other people who have left affected

1207
00:45:00,950 --> 00:44:58,240
who have told us of what's happening in

1208
00:45:02,630 --> 00:45:00,960
this military lab this is all we discuss

1209
00:45:05,190 --> 00:45:02,640
it at length in the book and document it

1210
00:45:07,430 --> 00:45:05,200
with many footnotes but um

1211
00:45:08,550 --> 00:45:07,440
yes it's not a presumption we're we're

1212
00:45:11,190 --> 00:45:08,560
learning that from people who have

1213
00:45:12,870 --> 00:45:11,200
defected and who have worked there

1214
00:45:14,309 --> 00:45:12,880
well the u.s is going to have some tough

1215
00:45:15,510 --> 00:45:14,319
decisions to make if this starts

1216
00:45:17,670 --> 00:45:15,520
becoming

1217
00:45:21,190 --> 00:45:17,680
well known and accepted that this is

1218
00:45:23,190 --> 00:45:21,200
what happened because there has to be

1219
00:45:25,030 --> 00:45:23,200
um some response there has to be some

1220
00:45:26,630 --> 00:45:25,040
retribution against china

1221
00:45:27,589 --> 00:45:26,640
for this and so forth

1222
00:45:29,589 --> 00:45:27,599
none

1223
00:45:31,190 --> 00:45:29,599
hopefully that that's correct hopefully

1224
00:45:33,030 --> 00:45:31,200
the demand last week from the

1225
00:45:35,670 --> 00:45:33,040
congressmen and women

1226
00:45:36,710 --> 00:45:35,680
for answers to the cover-up i mean

1227
00:45:37,750 --> 00:45:36,720
the world

1228
00:45:40,390 --> 00:45:37,760
the us

1229
00:45:42,230 --> 00:45:40,400
deserve that think about all of the

1230
00:45:44,550 --> 00:45:42,240
thousands of people that have died we

1231
00:45:46,230 --> 00:45:44,560
deserve answers to why

1232
00:45:48,550 --> 00:45:46,240
this cover-up theory was allowed to

1233
00:45:49,750 --> 00:45:48,560
persist right i think that's the first

1234
00:45:51,349 --> 00:45:49,760
step is getting the word out and

1235
00:45:52,790 --> 00:45:51,359
hopefully this book will do that thank

1236
00:45:54,630 --> 00:45:52,800
you again to our guest sarah wynn you

1237
00:45:56,870 --> 00:45:54,640
can check out her book the dancer and

1238
00:45:58,390 --> 00:45:56,880
the devil wherever you buy your books

1239
00:45:59,670 --> 00:45:58,400
thank you to our producer michael parker

1240
00:46:01,270 --> 00:45:59,680
thank you all for listening we'll be

1241
00:46:07,990 --> 00:46:01,280
back soon with another episode of the

1242
00:46:11,190 --> 00:46:09,430
thank you for listening to the truth

1243
00:46:14,790 --> 00:46:11,200
show with jim breslow

1244
00:46:16,950 --> 00:46:14,800
you can find us at hiddentruthshow.com

1245
00:46:19,750 --> 00:46:16,960
follow us on facebook twitter and

1246
00:46:21,510 --> 00:46:19,760
instagram that hit the truth show

1247
00:46:24,150 --> 00:46:21,520
join us again next week for another

1248
00:46:29,990 --> 00:46:24,160
episode of hidden truth show with jim